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| | Thursday, September 2 | |||||
| It's been exactly 10 years since Pete Rose received a lifetime suspension from baseball.
Rose, baseball's all-time hits leader, believes his suspension is unjust, especially when "Bart Giamatti signed the agreement that there was no finding I bet on baseball. Forget about his personal conclusion; let's go on the legalities of the situation." Rose, who recently appeared on ESPN's Up Close with host Gary Miller, says he has reconfigured his life and no longer participates in illegal gambling of any kind. "I think a lot of people are saying 'hey, the guy made a lot of mistakes, he knows he made a lot of mistakes, he paid for his mistakes, let him go on with his life,' because they see other things baseball has done in the last 10 and 15 years with other people," said Rose. The following is an edited transript of Rose's interview. Miller: Pete, we mark your 10-year anniversary since you were banned from baseball. What has changed in 10 years? Rose: Well, first of all Gary, I didn't apply for (reinstatement) the first eight years; it was obvious that Fay Vincent was not going to give me a fair opportunity, and then all of a sudden Bud Selig took over and you watched that situation. One day he was a commissioner and the next day he was head of a committee and the next day he was commissioner and then he backed out and wasn't the commissioner. Finally he took over a couple of years ago, and we decided that I had time to clean up my act, and baseball had time to get its house in order. We sent a letter of application, and the strange thing is we never heard from him.I mean, you may not think that's strange, but I would think that if you were a good businessman, and I did it (sent the letter) in a very professional way, that even if he's going to say "no" at this time, "we're not interested in talking to you," just write me a letter, send me his autograph, send me his autograph on the bottom of a piece of paper. I don't like to turn on your show or anybody else's show or listen to the radio and read the papers and Bud (Selig) says this and Bud says that. It's not the place to negotiate in papers or on TV, or on the radio. I confidentially sent him application, and he should confidentially answer me, I think, maybe I'm wrong. Miller: What was in that application? Rose: Just that we felt it was time, that had I reconfigured my life based on why I was suspended from baseball and by (former commissioner) Bart Giamatti. It was kind of unusual, because Bart never told the people exactly why I was suspended, and he never told the people what he meant when he said I was supposed to reconfigure my life. So all I did was read Rule 13, and it has different things about bribing an umpire, or betting on baseball, and it got down to hanging around undesirables, which I was guilty of and I was very wrong for doing that, and making illegal bets on football games, and I was wrong for doing that too.'Till this day, I no longer do any illegal gambling and I'm very selective with the people I associate with. Now, you're probably going to say "yeah, but you still go to casinos." Well, I do a lot of corporate appearances at casinos because I have to make a living, and you just wait for baseball to keep me out of the casinos and just give me an opportunity to go back on the field where I belong. Because #1, I won't have any desire to go make money in the casinos and #2, I won't have time. There's another point, I know you're aware of this, but there are 5 or 6 major league teams that have big, big casino signs in the ballpark. There are other teams that have the Lotto signs in the ballpark, so baseball is accepting gamblers' money, so to speak. Gambling is here, it was a craze in the '90s before and it's not going to go away. Miller: But you don't believe that if you stopped legal gambling, that suddenly baseball would say "he's clean?" Rose: No, I don't at all. It just seems that they comment about things I do like that, then on the other hand they accept the casinos' money for the advertising. You may think it's a good thing, you may think it's a bad thing. But do you think it's a good thing for all the youth of America to go to baseball games and see casino signs all over, that's saying it's OK to go, right? Miller: Well, I've seen their argument on it, to me that's a little different topic, but I see your point. You mentioned Bud Selig, and I'm a little amazed that he wouldn't at least talk to you. He did talk to Roy Firestone recently and they talked about you. Here's what the commissioner had to say:Selig: Do I wish sitting here today that none of that happened, of course I do. I mean, no one is better off because of that happening. It broke Bart's heart, literally I'm afraid, and I know what it's done to Pete and I'm sorry about that, nobody could enjoy that. But from the day you come into baseball, there's a code and you know right from wrong, and everybody knows right from wrong. Rose: That's interesting because, where is he insinuating on that code? Miller: He's talking about the placard that's in the clubhouse where it says "No betting on baseball." Rose: OK, that's fine, I read that everyday, it was right in my office. But he has to understand that Bart Giamatti signed the agreement that there was no finding I bet on baseball. Forget about his personal conclusion; let's go on the legalities of the situation. John Dowd did this report, this so-called expert report that came out, and it had all these reasons and all these findings that I bet on baseball and he turns it over to Giamatti, and two days later he signs a agreement that there were no findings that I bet on baseball. I understand what Bud is saying, he's absolutely right, if they found I bet on baseball. Am I wrong, Gary, or are we in a country where you are innocent until proven guilty? Well, has anybody ever proven that I betted on baseball? Miller: But you do say that if anyone bets on baseball knowingly they should be banned? Rose: I understand that, absolutely. I understand that wholeheartedly. I don't think they should be banned forever. Because when you say forever that's a long time ... I look at it like this, I have a 14-year-old son and I hope he does none of the following, but if I had a son who was a gambler, who was addicted to drugs, an alcoholic, or a wife beater, out of those four, I'd hope he becomes a gambler, I really do. I don't want him to do any of those four things, but out of the four I just mentioned, do you agree or disagree with it, because in the end you're only going to hurt yourself. You're going to cause problems for yourself and probably cause problems for your family. When you start drinking, or beating your wife up or you start doing cocaine, you can hurt a lot of other people, even on the way home. Miller: When the report first came out, you admitted clinically that you had some problems with gambling and you stopped gambling for a while, right? Rose: I had since that time stopped doing illegal gambling, but some of my best friends are into racing and I used to be into racing as far as owning horses, but when all of sudden you're suspended from a game you love and you lose a million-dollar job that supports your family, you say to yourself, let me go check and make sure, do I really have a problem or don't I have a problem? I wasn't the type of guy that would go and take my life savings with me, I wouldn't go home until it was all over, I wasn't that type of guy. I gambled for recreation. It's like, if I go to the races today, I only go maybe but two or three times a month, because I enjoy the competition, I enjoy watching. I enjoy that, there's a lot of reputable people in the racing industry so I can't bad-mouth going to the races. I went to a couple of Gambling Anonymous classes ... and I'm sitting there and I'm trying to analyze, I'm trying to learn and I'm hearing these people get up and tell their stories, but it just made me shake my head because I had nothing in common with these people. They were talking about stealing, they're talking about doing things to get money, talking about how they couldn't go home until everything was gone and stuff like this. I pay my bills, I've never missed house payments, I've never missed car payments or anything like that, so I had to stop and think. I tried to check out if I had an addiction and once I did all the research and talked to the doctors at the University of Cincinnati, I kind of didn't believe I had an addiction, and I know people say "he's in denial," but I could go for the next 30 days and not gamble. Now, I don't know if that's a guy with an addiction or not. All I can tell you is my behavior as far as the way I used to gamble. I mean, I could go to a casino and make a corporate appearance and not gamble because I'm not a casino-type gambler. I don't do dice, I don't do roulette, I don't do blackjack, I don't do things like that, I like horses. (2nd segment starts with a sound-bite from Frank Robinson from Up Close on July 26th)Frank Robinson: I know Rose, and he is dying inside because Pete Rose lives, eats, sleeps baseball. To have accomplished what he has accomplished and not be able to be in the Hall of Fame is a shame. It robs the public of not having Pete Rose in the Hall of Fame. It robs him, it robs his kids, his family knowing that their father is not in the Hall of Fame. So I would just like to see this thing resolved, and it has to start with Pete. Miller: Your reaction? Rose: I appreciate those kind words ... But Frank Robinson has to understand one thing, that Pete Rose is not dying inside. I mean, I'm a little disappointed that I'm not in baseball because I'm a baseball person, Gary. My whole kid life, I was a baseball player and my whole adult life, I was a baseball player and a manager on a baseball team. So for 50 years, I've been in a uniform playing baseball. And I'm a teacher, I love kids, I love young people playing baseball, I love the competition. But when I took the spikes off and put the bat in the rack, I wasn't the same guy when I left the ball park. I wasn't this tenacious, sometimes arrogant and cocky player. I had to be that way to be successful and Frank knows me, he knows I'm a lot different when I'm off the field. People are scared to come up to me at restaurants because they're scared I'll try to knock them down. The only time I try to knock you down is if you are trying to make a double ... That's the way I played, but outside of that, I'm a pretty nice guy. Miller: What is going on inside, if you're not dying inside? Rose: There's mixed emotions because of this so-called Anniversary week and I've been asked to do a lot of shows and radio shows and do a lot of things in the media. It's amazing to me how many people that report on this story don't really know the facts of this story, but they continue to report on it ... I think a lot of people are saying "hey, the guy made a lot of mistakes, he knows he made a lot of mistakes, he paid for his mistakes, let him go on with his life" because they see other things baseball has done in the last 10 and 15 years with other people.I'm not here to criticize those other people because almost all the people that have ever had a problem with baseball, whether it's alcohol, drugs, gambling, or domestic problems, are friends of mine, good friends of mine. I don't have too many enemies when it comes to being a baseball player or a baseball manager. Miller: Do you like the great debate about the fact that you're not in Cooperstown, in the Hall of Fame? Rose: No, I don't like that at all, I'm not trying to be arrogant, but I'm a Hall of Fame player. My statistics are of Hall of Fame caliber. I scored more runs, got more hits, and I won more games, and that's all I ever tried to do. I mean all of my friends are in Cooperstown, but inside, me knowing that I was that kind of player, sure I would love to have a plaque in Cooperstown.I did this thing with Bob Costas last week and I got to see the plaques and I got goose-bumps when I saw Ty Cobb's plaque and Babe Ruth's plaque, because I knew what they meant to the game of baseball. But I'm not going to die tomorrow if I don't go to the Hall of Fame, because my fans know what kind of player I was. I've said this before, but the Hall of Fame would mean more to my 14-year-old son and my 10-year-old daughter than anybody else because they didn't get to see me play. My older son and daughter got to see me play, but not my young kids, they never got to see me play. It would mean more to them for me to go into the Hall of Fame than anyone else. I understand the Hall of Fame and if I've embarrassed any of the Hall of Famers by anything I did in the past, I apologize, because I understand what Cooperstown means. I understand what that museum means, I understand what those plaques mean, I understand the history of the game, because I studied the history of the game. (3rd segment starts with sound-bite from Johnny Bench) Bench: If the evidence is there then the evidence is there. We can't change that, there are exceptions, you know, but I don't think there should be. Miller: What happened with you and Johnny Bench? Rose: Nothing happened with me and Johnny Bench. Johnny just has this belief and has beat this horse for the last 10 years now, and he's put himself in a corner where he can't say a positive thing about me. When I do card shows with Johnny, he's very cordial, very friendly, the only thing that disappoints me about Johnny is that sometimes he makes statements like he was at every lawyers' meeting we ever had. The last time I checked he's never been to any of those meetings. He acts like he's an expert on the Pete Rose case. All I can tell you about Johnny Bench is he is the greatest catcher that you and I have seen up until now. Miller: The All-Century team is going to appear at the World Series. In the balloting, you're currently ninth for outfielders. Bud Selig said if you make the team, you can go. Is that a crack in the door? Rose: Well, it's just a pleasure to be on the list of one hundred (greatest players) and to if I make that list, that's great ... I'm happy about the balloting because I look at it like this: because it's like America is speaking and I think Bud understands that. I think Bud Selig, who down to earth has never met me but would probably like me, and I say that because he hired Phil Garner, who was a Pete Rose type player, he hired Sal Bando, who was a Pete Rose type player. I think if Bud Selig had a gotten me working for him, he would have liked me, so someday I hope I can meet Bud Selig face to face and have him give me five minutes of his time. Miller: If you said "I bet on baseball," OK you're clean, you can be in the Hall of Fame, you can manage, does it mean more ... ? Rose: You don't really believe that, do you? Nah. Miller: If there was a written agreement that said it would, all you have to do is submit ... Rose: Nah, don't worry about it, there will never be an agreement like that, don't worry about it. Miller: Which means more, "I'm never going to admit I bet on baseball" or "let's be done with this thing and we never have to talk about it again and I'm back in baseball again?" Rose: I'm like Bud; I wish it would have never happened, I just hope we can find a way to resolve it, I really do, I'm looking to go on with my life, you know that as well as I do, and baseball is doing pretty good right now and nobody is bigger than this sport, never has been, never will be, closest anybody has ever come to being bigger in this sport is Babe Ruth. |  | |||||